Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: If Catholics are really good at anything, it's telling our priests how they should do their job. Actually, we become kind of connoisseurs of this experience. We go to Mass and it's like the homily was stale, the music was spicy, the confession was dry. We're really good at this. And here's the thing. I'm not going to be completely dismissive of that.
When a priest, in a reasonable way hears his people and tries to rise up to be the guy that they need, he might experience God making him the priest that God wants him to be.
But have you considered that the other experience, flip the tables. Is also true?
Guys, what if our priest actually has opinions about us?
I mean, you think your priest is boring? Go on the other side of the pulpit, look out at y'. All. That's boring. I preached to many, many congregations of people. I could see really boring. We're looking at you, too.
Welcome to the Chris Stefanik Show. We're here every week to give you the tools and inspiration you need to live your everyday life with joy, even when life gets crazy. If you want everyday inspiration for free, click below this video and sign up for the Daily Anchor. I want to shout out to our missionaries of joy. It's because of you that this and all the things that we're doing to bring the hope of Jesus to the world is happening.
A link to become a missionary. Joy is also in the show notes. And finally, this episode is sponsored in part by ewtn. You can catch this and so much more on EWTN streaming. Guess where the link is for that? That's in the show notes, too. What if, guys, we listened to our priests, listened to our priests talk about what the ideal congregation is or what the ideal confession is.
Guys. Not just to respond to a priest who's being persnickety, but if we can hear that in a reasonable way, maybe we'll become the kind of congregation or people of God that God wants us to be.
And that's part of the whole beauty of the incarnational reality of the church, that we're people coming together and God speaks through that. So I could think of no better priest to bring in to gripe about how you stink sometimes than Father Leopoldinghog.
[00:02:19] Speaker B: Exactly. I am a master at complaining, you know. Well, it's interesting because in my community, we actually have a spirituality called the three fives. And the first set of fives are just prayers that we should say. So things that you already do. The second set of fives, however, are attitudes and ready for this, the first attitude is practice the presence of God.
Be a servant, be a peacemaker.
No complaining, no criticism.
So technically, when people check me and they, like Father Leo, are you criticizing? I say, no, I'm observing loudly.
[00:02:56] Speaker A: Hey, that's true. Right? There's a way. There's always a workaround.
[00:02:59] Speaker B: But it's very difficult not to critique. And I can tell you, you set up this scenario perfectly. As soon as I sit down. I'm not a parish priest anymore, so I can actually say this.
However, I was a parish priest for many years, but I'm in a parish every weekend giving talks, missions, you know, whatever, presentations. And I'll say Mass at these places no matter where I go. I find the same challenging things everywhere.
And you're probably. Well, where are they?
[00:03:32] Speaker A: No, really? Yeah. What are they? I mean, what do you want to jump into first? A lack of prayerfulness about Mass or confession?
[00:03:40] Speaker B: Well, you tell me.
[00:03:41] Speaker A: Yeah, you pick.
[00:03:42] Speaker B: Pick any.
[00:03:43] Speaker A: Okay, I'm going.
One and five. Yeah, go.
[00:03:46] Speaker B: So four.
[00:03:47] Speaker A: Confession.
[00:03:47] Speaker B: Let's take confession.
[00:03:49] Speaker A: Right. There's sometimes lay people come into confession, and I've heard them complain about priests not being pastoral enough or not saying anything because they're falling asleep or whatever. You know, there's always the quick complaint about the priest.
Don't hold back on us here. We need to hear this.
What's the nightmare confession to hear?
[00:04:08] Speaker B: Well, the nightmare confession to hear is when someone is going on and on and on, and they just went to confession last week. I have two minutes before I have to get out of there. And there's a long line of people.
[00:04:20] Speaker A: I can tell you, as a man who stands in those lines, that's my nightmare experience.
Would you please just say your sin?
[00:04:27] Speaker B: Yeah, but we're grateful.
[00:04:29] Speaker A: Sorry.
I feel kind of bad saying this.
[00:04:32] Speaker B: I feel bad even just sharing this because I'm so grateful that people even go to confession. I think one of the struggles is that we don't make confession available for people. So, you know, like the half an hour before the Saturday evening Mass. I'm sorry. We as priests need to do a lot better. But the confessions, and I actually did an episode on this. The worst kind of confessions are the ones where people are confessing their spouses or their kids sins.
[00:04:56] Speaker A: I'm not supposed to do that, huh?
[00:04:58] Speaker B: Yeah, no, it's. I mean, I want to hear you, you know, not what your wife or your kids did, but then it turned. Because it then turns into a counseling session.
And a confession can have a counsel kind of atmosphere to it, but it's not a counseling session because many priests aren't licensed counselors.
[00:05:18] Speaker A: Why do people do that?
[00:05:20] Speaker B: Because they need to get it off their chest. Because they're in pain. And the church is the triage. It's the hospital for the sinner. And so they go wanting to experience healing, but they forget that the healing is just when they say their sins. The image.
[00:05:37] Speaker A: You're a healing right there.
[00:05:38] Speaker B: Exactly. So you know the Old Testament seraph serpents biting the Jewish people as they're complaining in the desert.
God says, make a bronze serpent. If people just so look at it, they will be healed. That's an image of confession. It's them just looking at the ugliness of their sins.
[00:05:56] Speaker A: Oh, wow.
[00:05:57] Speaker B: And the sin recognition before God in faith, that's what sets you free.
[00:06:03] Speaker A: Wow. So cut to the chase. Look at your. Don't be afraid of it.
[00:06:06] Speaker B: Just do it. Just do it.
[00:06:07] Speaker A: Just say it out loud.
[00:06:08] Speaker B: Exactly. Then it stones.
[00:06:10] Speaker A: And you're never shocked. You know, when I say, what's the nightmare? Confession. Someone watching might think, yeah, how big of a sin is going to freak Father out? You probably rejoice. The bigger the sin is to take it away.
[00:06:19] Speaker B: I heard confession. I mean, like, I work with ex.
[00:06:22] Speaker A: Cons, so you get some biggies.
[00:06:24] Speaker B: But I don't hear their confessions. But I did go into the prisons and I have heard their confessions and nothing shocks me. And I've been a priest over 25 years. So you've heard just about everything.
[00:06:38] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:38] Speaker B: The other challenge is, is when someone is either scrupulous and they are.
They can fall into the temptation of despair.
[00:06:50] Speaker A: Oh, wow.
[00:06:51] Speaker B: And. And you want to tell them, trust me, that's not a big deal.
[00:06:57] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:06:57] Speaker B: Then. Then you're accused of being not a real priest because for them it is a big deal. And I keep saying, but it's really not a big deal. The other is. Is the opposite side.
[00:07:08] Speaker A: And that's a big deal.
It's not a big deal. Like when people think it's a big deal, what are they doing? How are they conflating it in their minds?
[00:07:18] Speaker B: So there's only so much I can say because I keep so serious, the sacramental seal of confession that I don't even want to give anything that anyone could have said to me.
[00:07:30] Speaker A: Well, the state of Washington said that you have to tell me exactly. This is one of the things you can see him commenting on him.
[00:07:35] Speaker B: As you can tell, I'm glad we're in Colorado.
[00:07:36] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right, dude. Really? It's so serious. I want to talk about this for a second. If I come into the confessional and say, father, my sin is that you're sitting on a bus that I put in the church.
[00:07:46] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:07:46] Speaker A: You literally can't run out and turn me into the authorities.
[00:07:49] Speaker B: No.
[00:07:51] Speaker A: That's heavy.
[00:07:51] Speaker B: But guess what?
I will die a martyr.
I will put my palm on that. Like, take me, Jesus, take me to heaven.
But actually, confession is a place where priests do experience the sacrifice because we have to enter into the suffering that people are going through.
And that's the compassion that people want.
But so often so depending on your parish, if you talk about confessions, well, pastorally, well, you'll get quality confessions. If you don't talk about it, then you're just going to get standard, run of the mill. Bless me, Father, for I have sinned. It's been two weeks. They're devotional confessions, which are good, but sometimes your heart is not removed. It's done out of obligation, not out of love.
So the best kind of confessions are those that are really connected to one thing. To love Jesus more. I want to know Jesus love how beautiful it is.
[00:08:42] Speaker A: I mean, as a guy who makes confessions, I could say the times in my life that I probably made it too big. My sin too big in my mind is when I associate my very person with what I did. Like I am the thing I did. I'm broken in that way. The evil one's called the accuser in Revelation.
He loves when I sin. He loves more when I'm convinced that I am the thing I did when I sinned.
[00:09:06] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:09:06] Speaker A: Right.
And the scrupulosity becomes like, the doctor doesn't really understand. I really am dying. Right. You don't get it. I'm this bad.
[00:09:15] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:09:16] Speaker A: And then you get accused of being, what, a liberal priest for not saying, no, no, son, you are that bad. You stink. You're horrible. Right?
[00:09:22] Speaker B: That's what people want. They want to literally be beaten.
[00:09:25] Speaker A: Why does somebody want that?
[00:09:26] Speaker B: Because of them not understanding the new commandment, love one another as I have loved you.
[00:09:33] Speaker A: Hey, friend. I want to invite you into something that's changing lives.
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[00:10:57] Speaker B: Love one another as I have loved you. They are going just to the Golden Rule version, and it's treat one another as you want to be treated. And I think we like to just impose abuse on ourselves and therefore we can inflict it on others. Like, I can only be lovable if I am this, this, this, and the other. And because I expect that of me, I'm going to inflict that on you.
So confession is not about confronting yourself only. It's about confronting the incredible unconditional mercy of God. And that scares the hell into people.
And so they take a cheaper version of confession and they just want to make it about making me feel good because I don't want to have this sin on my soul anymore. And I say, but then there's a remedial side. Can we get to the core of why that sin even existed in the first place? And people don't want to go there.
[00:11:52] Speaker A: So the frustration as a priest is, would you please, would you please let God love you?
[00:11:56] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:11:56] Speaker A: Would you please, like, let him forgive you?
[00:11:58] Speaker B: Correct. And sometimes I'll even say to people, I know that you want to just get rid of this sin, but can I ask you as a spiritual counsel, this is not your penance. Can you take the sin that you are most ashamed of and hold it in your hand before Jesus and look at every aspect of it? Just look at every aspect of it. Because I want you to see that maybe it's not as terrible as you think. Maybe it's connected to love, albeit a broken version.
And we're obviously going to be talking about sexual sins because that's what people think the most when they go to confession.
[00:12:33] Speaker A: Right? Right.
[00:12:34] Speaker B: Most of those sins are not as bad as people think.
Yeah, it's the world that wants to make it.
That's the. That's the key. The devil will tempt you with this, and Jesus will challenge you before you can commit that sin. But as soon as you commit that sin, Jesus is the first to forgive. The devil is the first to accuse.
And so what I want people to do is not to be afraid to look at their sins really, and learn from.
[00:13:04] Speaker A: It's funny, too. You bring up sexual sins. I think Adante's description of hell.
[00:13:08] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:13:09] Speaker A: The top layer is the people who have committed a lot of sexual sins.
[00:13:13] Speaker B: Correct. It's still hell.
[00:13:14] Speaker A: It can still get you.
[00:13:14] Speaker B: I mean, it's like nobody wants to go there because of sexual sins, but.
[00:13:17] Speaker A: It'S almost probably boringly easy for the Lord to say, yeah, we got that one. Okay, next, let's go deeper.
[00:13:23] Speaker B: And the deeper ones are when we commit the sins of injustice, really. Because God is so just that the injustice. And people think immediately. Social justice. And now I'm a big lib. No, it has nothing to do with that.
[00:13:35] Speaker A: Well, you are.
[00:13:36] Speaker B: Well, because the injustice is rooted in not seeing the other person in the image and likeness of God.
[00:13:44] Speaker A: That's the real offense behind it all.
[00:13:46] Speaker B: It really is.
[00:13:48] Speaker A: So confessions that are.
Father, give me an hour of counseling. And you're like, dude, can we get to the real thing here? Correct again. Counseling is important, but you got to know which place you're going to for what thing. Right.
[00:14:00] Speaker B: Look behind you before you go.
[00:14:02] Speaker A: Yeah, please, please just take a look back. Okay.
[00:14:06] Speaker B: Because there are going to be some big fish out there that just like to get in there.
[00:14:09] Speaker A: Yeah. And so much healing just comes from saying this. So then there's people who just don't want to forgive themselves and don't trust you.
[00:14:15] Speaker B: It's the despair. That's the scrupulosity.
[00:14:17] Speaker A: Despair. Then presumption.
[00:14:19] Speaker B: Presumption, which basically is, I wasn't that bad.
Oh, no, that was bad.
[00:14:24] Speaker A: People literally sit down and tell you.
[00:14:26] Speaker B: So bless me, Father, for I have sent. It's been about 25 years. I told a couple lies and maybe didn't say a couple prayers.
Well, then you're a saint.
Yeah. I mean, there's more. Trust me, I think there's more. And so when I'll just pastorally go through the Ten Commandments, so the first thing I say is 20 years. I always say, welcome home, welcome back. And then I'll say, you know, you may not remember all of these things, but let's go through some of the Ten Commandments and just ask you a few questions. And you can just simply answer yes and no. I'm not here to pry, but I am here to make sure that we uncover the depths of it all. You know, when you told a lie, what was it? And why did you tell the lie? And the lie was cheating on a spouse.
[00:15:09] Speaker A: Oh, there's a detail you.
[00:15:11] Speaker B: Exactly. But it's a lie. But there was more to it than that.
And so it's just a real reminder that people are still very afraid to confront their humanity and admit it to the world. Yet they do it all the time on the Jerry Springer Show.
[00:15:31] Speaker A: Isn't that funny? We all need to go to confession. That's why those shows exist.
[00:15:34] Speaker B: Even the Pope Goes to Confession. Mother Teresa went to confession.
[00:15:39] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:40] Speaker B: You know, the only person who didn't have to go to confession was the Blessed Mother, but she knew who she was. I'm just a simple maidservant. And Jesus himself didn't have to go because he was the one who gives forgiveness. But he's the one who showed us what the pain of sin does to you. When he was scourged and when he was beaten, when he had to carry his cross and when he was killed.
[00:16:02] Speaker A: There's a great Augustine quote about presumption and.
And despair.
[00:16:06] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:16:07] Speaker A: That on each side of Jesus there were two thieves crucified. One of them despaired when one of them went to hell. Don't presume one of them went to heaven. Don't despair.
[00:16:16] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:16:17] Speaker A: Right.
It's that dangerous middle place of the relationship with God, letting him love us, that. Like, I'm not just on a path that I can just figure out.
It's not moralism. It's this relationship with.
[00:16:30] Speaker B: Doesn't it make you love Pope Leo even more because he's an Augustinian?
[00:16:34] Speaker A: Yeah. Honestly. Yeah. When he said he's the son of St. Augustine, I thought, okay, this is a good sign.
[00:16:38] Speaker B: Very good sign. Because it starts at a place of human reality which is broken now. We gotta make our way upward. And so those are the challenging confessions, to be honest with you. The other ones, I have to say, too. And this is no fault.
[00:16:53] Speaker A: This is your chance, Father, we complain about you all the time. Just unload. Let's do it.
[00:16:57] Speaker B: Let's do it. When they speak so softly that I cannot hear them, and then when I ask them to speak up, they still can't do it. So it's at a whisper. Also the ones.
[00:17:11] Speaker A: But wait, there's more.
[00:17:12] Speaker B: There's more. The ones who have to give us an entire backstory.
[00:17:17] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. And that's partly to make the case that it's rationalizing. Yeah, I'm rational. Lies, right?
[00:17:25] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:25] Speaker A: I'm not that bad, Father.
[00:17:27] Speaker B: Well, I do it all the time in my own confession because I go to a spiritual director.
So the whole thing is like one big confession. So I'll eventually get to the sin, but I got to tell this whole backstory. And my confessor, God bless him, he's also my spiritual director, he'll say, so the sin was that. But you wanted to tell me all of this beforehand. But the whole backstory, it does get a little challenging to hear all of it, because I just want to say I kind of don't care.
[00:17:55] Speaker A: Yeah, right.
[00:17:56] Speaker B: But you do. But for that moment, I just don't care.
[00:18:00] Speaker A: Yeah. I love that you take some weight off, to be honest with you. Let's get the job done.
[00:18:06] Speaker B: I hope for them it does.
[00:18:08] Speaker A: Right.
[00:18:09] Speaker B: And you're right. There are those people who want to get beaten up in the confession. And so I'm like, that's not who I am. That's not what the church does.
[00:18:18] Speaker A: So John 20, 21, 23, Jesus breathing the apostles, he sends you forgive or forgiven them. So he established confession right there. I think one of the great reasons he did it was that if we cut to the chase and articulate our sins and get it out there, we realize that's not me. And that's also not the all consuming thing in my life. That's a part of me that God's actually bigger than and can take away. It's so psychologically healing. So I want to thank you for receiving that. I mean, you're giving us the sacrament.
And when people say, why don't I go straight to God? It's a sacramental encounter. You're going straighter to God than you could by going to your room and praying. Right.
[00:18:53] Speaker B: And it's. Yeah, exactly. And it's also establishing a level of maturity.
[00:18:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:59] Speaker B: Because we say it to our kids. It takes a big boy, it takes a big girl to say, I'm sorry. It's just a part of growing in your faith. And if you are constantly keeping your sins within, you're never going to grow. It's the difference between guilt and. And shame.
Guilt is a terrible feeling. But when you bring it to the Lord, he actually gives you a life lesson from it. It tells you what's right and wrong.
Shame is the exact opposite. You did the exact same thing that gave you guilt, but you hide it. You keep it under a bushel basket and you let it Fester. And the only thing that grows is your shame.
[00:19:37] Speaker A: Oof. Dang. Like mold in a dark corner.
[00:19:40] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:19:41] Speaker A: So thanks for. Thanks for ministering that sacrament to people, but thanks for receiving that.
[00:19:46] Speaker B: Amen.
[00:19:46] Speaker A: Is there.
What do you feel like after hours of confession? Do you get tired? Do you feel, like, dumped on? I mean, you just heard a lot of junk for an hour or two.
[00:19:58] Speaker B: So it really depends on the scenario.
You know, there was a. Obviously, John Vianney, the patron saint of all priests. He just spent his whole life in the confession.
[00:20:08] Speaker A: And. And Padre Pio, he'd be like, padre Pio.
[00:20:11] Speaker B: And so some people do have a ministry of compassion in the same way. Not everyone. Not every priest is good for hospital ministry. Not every priest is good for youth ministry. So I do think that there are priests who have a unique charism to just make yourself available for confession. And so for me, I have a strange temperament because while I am very public, I am very introverted. I really like to be left alone.
[00:20:41] Speaker A: So you're physically in pain with a guy like me?
[00:20:44] Speaker B: Right now, I am just dying.
[00:20:45] Speaker A: It's agony.
[00:20:46] Speaker B: It's just, you know, and so if you want to know what it's like, this is what it's like. I will smile but love you.
No, it's hard for me, actually, to hear long hours of confession because I am so emotionally invested in it. But at the end of the day, when you are finished a confession and, you know, it's a practice for me just to say a prayer for the sins that I've heard and pray for the people.
There is a lightness in you.
I think it's when Jesus says, you know, carry my yoke. It is easy, and my burden is light. God does give priests, confessors, a grace.
[00:21:24] Speaker A: That's awesome.
[00:21:25] Speaker B: Also a grace to forget.
I verily, very rarely remember who went to confession and what they said.
[00:21:34] Speaker A: I've heard that from many priests.
[00:21:35] Speaker B: Yeah, it's true.
[00:21:37] Speaker A: I love Saint John Nepomasine, who's. There was a king that wanted to know, what did my wife confess to you? And then martyred him because he wouldn't tell him.
[00:21:45] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:21:45] Speaker A: And he's got. He's using icons like this.
[00:21:48] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:21:49] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:21:50] Speaker B: I mean, that's the whole.
That's the whole beauty of confession.
Is there a place on this side of heaven where you can tell the truth and be set free?
The devil does not want you to encounter that moment of grace and will use your fear or whatever lies you want to believe that we're told about the Church and the evils that we've committed to do everything possible to not encounter the truth of yourself.
[00:22:24] Speaker A: And the people who would be in support of that Washington bill, their first response would be like, well, the person's a pedophile. They're not human. They're not entitled to that. Or, that person's a murderer. He's not entitled to that. He's a monster. And the confessional says, no, everybody is a human. And everybody has a chance with the intimate experience with God to experience forgiveness.
And you'll tell that penitent, go turn yourself in. Right?
But still, that sacred spot is not going to be interfered with by anybody ever. And I just. Thanks for upholding that.
[00:22:58] Speaker B: Because if the people know that a priest is no longer bound by a.
[00:23:03] Speaker A: Seal, yeah, no one will go.
[00:23:05] Speaker B: No one will go. And so guess what? Saints can't be made.
And where do you find saints in the confessional?
Because there they tell the truth, and the truth sets them free.
[00:23:16] Speaker A: Amen.
[00:23:16] Speaker B: You co in a sinner, you walk out a saint.
[00:23:20] Speaker A: There's people watching who are, you know, thinking, I don't want to go to confession because what I have is way too big. It's just way too big.
I would imagine that your favorite, favorite, favorite kind of confession is the one that's just so big that a guy comes in and Sundays, it's been 30 years since my last confession. I cheated on my wife and killed someone. You're like, oh, like King David, right?
[00:23:41] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Well, you know when they always say.
[00:23:45] Speaker A: How does that feel? Like when you catch a big fish? Is that like. Yeah.
[00:23:50] Speaker B: To be honest with you, I will.
[00:23:53] Speaker A: Not say, okay, I love that, because.
[00:23:57] Speaker B: It'S not up to us. You know, Christ is the one who catches them in the net, brings them to the bark of Peter. But I think you're asking, is there satisfaction in this mission?
[00:24:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:08] Speaker B: Yes, there is. It is hard work, but it is incredibly satisfying knowing that there is an unmerited, unconditional, loving God who created a church to be the instrument of their salvation.
[00:24:26] Speaker A: I love it, man. And this is why people like throughout, throughout the centuries have kissed the priest's hands. You know what I mean? Like, there's a thing you can do as an instrument of Jesus Christ. When you take away sins and people hear those words, I absolve you in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. That's literally like magic.
[00:24:45] Speaker B: But it is very true that the seriousness of this sacrament is where saints are made, because then it gives you the opportunity to go and Receive the Eucharist and receive the fullness of that grace without any, any inhibitions. You are literally in true communion. That's literally almost a glimpse of the divine communion of heaven.
[00:25:13] Speaker A: Praise God.
[00:25:14] Speaker B: To receive communion in the state of grace.
[00:25:16] Speaker A: Hallelujah.
[00:25:17] Speaker B: I love being Catholic.
[00:25:18] Speaker A: Speaking of receiving Communion, let's transition now to Mass.
[00:25:21] Speaker B: Oh, yes. Okay.
[00:25:21] Speaker A: We all know what we want from you.
We want your homily not to stink.
[00:25:26] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:25:28] Speaker A: Is that so much to ask?
[00:25:29] Speaker B: That's what I want for me, too.
[00:25:31] Speaker A: And you are writing a book about this. So this is a valid complaint that, like, Father, if your name was Mother Teresa, I'd be interested in your thoughts off the top of your head. But since you're not like, for the rest of us, please prepare something.
[00:25:43] Speaker B: And you know what's interesting and not five things. Maybe one thing I think priests do, but I think they get they sometimes.
Okay, I'll just tell you. Masses aside, giving homilies is very challenging because I think we as priests might be so disconnected from a lot of people's realities that we're talking at one level and they're at another level.
So what we need to do to heal that is get you all talking together. Can we create opportunities where priests are hearing what you are going through, and the best place to do it is a dinner table? Secondly, I love that.
[00:26:21] Speaker A: I want to pause there for one sec. I worked my first.
Well, my second boss. I was at a parish in the East LA area, and this priest was from America, Spain, and had a third thick accent. Man, he tried so hard, you know, he would have a staff meeting to work on his homily, like before he started praying about it all week.
How does this hit you as a layperson? Let's read the readings together and just listened. There you go. You know, it's not the hardest thing as a missionary. The first step is to listen to the people you're a missionary to, and your life is different than ours.
[00:26:51] Speaker B: Perfect.
[00:26:52] Speaker A: Listen.
[00:26:53] Speaker B: And that's hard because we don't have those opportunities. And unfortunately, when people do talk to us, they're either grieving or they're complaining. And it. And it really creates an unrealistic relationship that I can be a father who not only prays with his children, but also plays with them.
So you almost create a distance, and you make that altar rail, the separation between us and you. And so you are only a father sacramentally. And that is true. We are sacramental fathers. But we have to have a character of what a loving father would do for their Children. And we would have to listen to their kids.
[00:27:33] Speaker A: That's awesome.
[00:27:34] Speaker B: And that's not easy.
[00:27:36] Speaker A: It dignified me, too. Like, if a priest is thinking, well, no one would want to do that. I'm telling you, people would be so honored.
[00:27:42] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:27:42] Speaker A: To have a little team where you ran things by them every Monday and prayed together. Man, that'd be so cool.
[00:27:46] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh. It gets bad when they say, great homily, Father. I'm like, the deacon preached jerky.
[00:27:53] Speaker A: That's awesome. Okay, so we've talked already for probably too long about, you know, more about what we need from our priest. What do you need from us? What's the. You know, I could tell you what the nightmare homily is. What's the nightmare congregation? How do we bring it better in a way that doesn't bore you out of your mind as the guy on the other side of the pulpit?
[00:28:12] Speaker B: Well, I'm just gonna say these are helpful tips that Catholics should not make.
Try to come to church before Mass starts.
If you are frequently late, it really shows a level of disrespect to the Lord. And so I think if people are there and they're ready and they're prepared, you know, nothing prepared. Nothing is better for a priest that, like, when he get ready to say Mass than to know that his parishioners were preparing spiritually for Mass. That's like a highlight.
That's just amazing. But if we're just watching people talk, oh, Father's here. We gotta go in now. Like, no, Jesus is in there. Go in anyway. You know, I mean, that's not it. So just being prepared.
[00:28:53] Speaker A: And I'm sure you're happy with whoever's coming in. And yet. And yet how uninspiring when people are trickling in. Well, this is, I think, worse among white cultures than a lot of others.
I was in a Vietnamese Mass once.
[00:29:08] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:29:08] Speaker A: Right. We had. We thought there was an evening Mass, and there wasn't. And it was a holy day of obligation. And the only one we found, like, oh, my gosh, Was there a 3pm Vietnamese mass?
There were two families that were late. It was our family and a Mexican family.
[00:29:21] Speaker B: Filipino.
[00:29:21] Speaker A: I know. I know you're Filipino. I totally know. Totally different.
[00:29:23] Speaker B: I know.
[00:29:26] Speaker A: We were both late. The Vietnamese, dude, they were packed in there.
Like, they were early. Like, culturally, they kind of had this sense, we're going in early.
I don't know.
[00:29:36] Speaker B: The Germans are that way too.
[00:29:37] Speaker A: Germans are that way too. Okay.
[00:29:38] Speaker B: They are showing up and they are.
[00:29:40] Speaker A: The Irish are not that Way that.
[00:29:41] Speaker B: Might be true, but I think, listen, Filipinos are late all the time, you know, but in the Philippines, they're all there on time.
[00:29:49] Speaker A: That was my experience when I went to the Philippines. Man, they were so. It's not a cultural event.
[00:29:53] Speaker B: It's an attitude thing of not making mass the priority for your day.
And you can see that in people in the sloppiness of their arrival.
And it hurts a little bit because you're like, this is the most important thing we do in our life.
This is it. The second is, gosh, I just want people to at least mouth the words to the songs. Mouth the words to the creed, Mouth the words to the Gloria. Even if it's completely unsingable, just mouth the words. We call it fake it till you make it.
And it's true. Because oftentimes, if I'm not fake feeling it in prayer, I will just say the words out loud.
I will sing a song out loud, and it changes you.
So I think people should not make the mistake of just being so passive. It would be as frustrating to a whole, say, soccer team if all of your fans just sat there.
Dang.
[00:30:54] Speaker A: Right.
Just drains the life out of you as the cell is, I'm sure.
And then people wonder why you look so tired.
[00:31:01] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:31:02] Speaker A: Dude, you just suck.
[00:31:03] Speaker B: Cause you're just trying to pull it out of them, just trying. So mouth the words.
[00:31:07] Speaker A: Show up early. Mouth the words. Or better yet, actually sing and say the words.
[00:31:11] Speaker B: Yeah. Even if you. I mean, look, I've sat next to people who can't sing, and it is painful to hear that, but they try. And that's if they get an A for effort. And they get an A because they're.
[00:31:23] Speaker A: Glorifying A for effort.
[00:31:25] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.
I think the other things that kind of drive us a little crazy, too, is when this is gonna sound terrible. This is gonna just sound absolutely terrible when they just have a look on their face like they're ready to die.
[00:31:48] Speaker A: Hold on. Do they look right now? Define it.
[00:31:53] Speaker B: They look.
[00:31:54] Speaker A: Do that one more time. I want to zoom in.
[00:31:56] Speaker B: No, please don't zoom in.
It's a terrible look.
[00:32:02] Speaker A: You're good at that.
[00:32:03] Speaker B: Because, trust me, I go to many churches, and sometimes I have to listen to other people's homilies, too.
And I.
I'm one of those priests that try not to do this.
I'm listening, but I'm praying. Look. Because they close their eyes, and I know some people listen better that way, but it's hard for us.
So I do everything I can to look at them. And I kind of give affirmation, I think, just that it's like if you're looking at someone you love and they're looking at you like this million.
It's like, what are you.
[00:32:43] Speaker A: Totally. Are you there?
[00:32:44] Speaker B: Show me.
[00:32:46] Speaker A: Bring it.
[00:32:46] Speaker B: It's hard to look at a congregation.
Thankfully, that's not a lot of my experiences when I am there, a lot of people are enthusiastic. I think it's because they're paying me to show up at these places.
[00:33:00] Speaker A: Right. You're there at conferences and things where people didn't have to, quote, have to go.
[00:33:05] Speaker B: Yeah, they get to go kind of thing.
So that's it. And then obviously, what drives all priests crazy is when people don't know how to receive Communion.
I think oftentimes it's because people are unprepared and these are not regular communicants, and so they probably shouldn't be receiving Communion anyway. But you don't know what to do. And so it's not up to us to have a little inquisition moment.
So it's very difficult.
And then when you have liturgical ministers who don't know what they're doing, it can be very challenging as well.
[00:33:44] Speaker A: Yeah.
So what's some of the craziest that you get when someone comes up about to give them communion and they do.
[00:33:52] Speaker B: Bite of Christ, and they're like, what? They just kind of look at you.
[00:33:55] Speaker A: Oh, my God.
[00:33:56] Speaker B: And they don't know what to do, and so they'll just take it.
[00:33:57] Speaker A: Oh, no.
[00:33:58] Speaker B: We call it the grabbers.
And then I'll say, I'm sorry, are you Catholic? No, I'm like, okay, can I please handle that?
[00:34:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:05] Speaker B: So just give that back, and then I will give you a little blessing, you know? And so it's those moments where also when people walk away with communion and I have to run down the aisle to ask them to consume it.
[00:34:17] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:19] Speaker B: These are real scenarios.
[00:34:21] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:22] Speaker B: And it's disturbing. Well, it's even more disturbing when you have someone say, father, there's communion in the pew.
And so what do we have to do for that? And it really just kind of hurts your heart.
[00:34:35] Speaker A: Right, right.
One of the arguments people make for receiving on the tongue.
[00:34:38] Speaker B: On the tongue, for sure.
And I respect all of it.
[00:34:42] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I receive in my hand almost all the time, but there was a time I was receiving on my. Like, what is it? Saints Cyril of Jerusalem talked about receiving on the hand with your hands. This is ancient. An ancient practice also.
[00:34:54] Speaker B: It is.
[00:34:55] Speaker A: Right. This is not only One ancient practice.
[00:34:57] Speaker B: With a tongue that's actually the more ancient than receiving under the tongue. The tongue was kind of like a later development to show the reverend.
[00:35:04] Speaker A: Okay, your last chance. Anything else you want to unload about what you need from us?
[00:35:08] Speaker B: Do not leave early. Just do not do it.
It's very frustrating. It literally saps the.
It just. It drives priests crazy. I mean, people say, well, what about crying children? I love crying children. I'd rather have a church of crying children.
[00:35:27] Speaker A: Thank you for that.
[00:35:28] Speaker B: Nothing at all. You know, obviously, places, you know, if it's disrupting people, take your child out. Not a big deal, but it's the arrogance of just receiving communion and you walk right out. You just don't care.
It's very discouraging for priests.
[00:35:48] Speaker A: I always wait for the priest to get past me in the aisle. Then I feel like I'm okay leaving. Of course, Judas was the first to leave La Salle.
[00:35:54] Speaker B: I say that to people all the time.
[00:35:57] Speaker A: Don't want to be that guy.
[00:35:58] Speaker B: It's cheap. It's just a cheap way of doing things.
[00:36:01] Speaker A: Thanks for calling it out.
[00:36:02] Speaker B: And we have to. And what I think can be very helpful is what one priest did.
He said at the end of Mass, I just want everyone to say three Hail Marys, one for your family, one for you, and one for the world.
And it was the most amazing thing to go to this church, see very few people leave, and then even wait till the song ended, having people drop to their knees and pray. And then they came out to greet the priest.
[00:36:33] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:36:33] Speaker B: Like, let's clone that.
[00:36:37] Speaker A: Praise God.
[00:36:37] Speaker B: Let's make that happen every day.
[00:36:38] Speaker A: Yeah, it's beautiful, dude. Inspiring people make inspiring priests. Inspiring priests make inspiring people.
[00:36:44] Speaker B: But the pastor's personality matters.
So here's where. While I'm talking about parishioners, sometimes the complaint is really directed to the pastor, who is either lax and just not taking the liturgy as seriously for his congregant than he does, maybe for himself.
[00:37:04] Speaker A: But, you know, we could help you rise up if we take it seriously. If he sees a thousand people out there taking it so seriously, it's going to form him. Absolutely.
We're clericalists. And it's not our priests usually aren't. It's the people who are.
[00:37:15] Speaker B: They can be, right?
[00:37:16] Speaker A: We super can be. I mean, like, the church is lonely. Father should fix that, right? Well, dude, if you see a new person come in the door, he's busy doing stuff right now. Why don't you go say hi and welcome to my church? Right?
[00:37:27] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:37:28] Speaker A: I have A small group. I meet with guys. Come join the small group. Like, you make the church not lonely. We're looking at like, that plant's dying. Father should water it. Dude, there's one father. There's a thousand of you. You got a water bottle. Just dump it in the plant and move on with your day.
[00:37:40] Speaker B: Correct. Help out a little bit because it is a family.
And ultimately, if we're just relying on one person, you can see how it's easy for that priest to get burnt out. And priests do get burnt out. And so it's incredibly important to have a community that actually works together, because if you don't work, you don't eat.
[00:37:57] Speaker A: Thank you for being the kind of priest that really takes seriously being the spiritual father that we need.
[00:38:05] Speaker B: I try.
[00:38:06] Speaker A: Yeah. And I know you do. And you listen to people and you try to rise up and feed them.
And thanks for sharing how we can return the favor, because I think in doing that for each other, just on a human level, sacramental grace aside, on a human level, God brings us together to purify each other. So we need to listen to y', all, too. And so thanks for sharing all this.
[00:38:27] Speaker B: My pleasure. And with your spirit, could you lead.
[00:38:30] Speaker A: Us in a prayer?
[00:38:31] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:38:31] Speaker A: Bless the people watching. How does blessing work through a tv? Or, you know, it does the job.
[00:38:36] Speaker B: It's grace. It's grace. I mean, this is the new pulpit, so just pray to be better at what we do, Lord, and give us the grace to say yes to your most divine will. Thank you for this time together. And we thank you for the opportunity to become the saints you call us to be. Let us be like Mary and say, let it be done according to thy will. And may almighty God bless you and all of your listeners and followers, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
[00:39:02] Speaker A: Amen. I love you, brother. Thank you for being with me, man. I'm looking forward to our meal together tonight. Now let's make this tenderloin. We take cooking for the guy who beat Bobby Flay very seriously.
[00:39:12] Speaker B: Better because I'm coming as a judge. I'm coming as a judge.
[00:39:15] Speaker A: Totally.
And I love you guys. Thanks for watching. Dude, Priests who are watching, we love you. Thanks for your sacrifice. When you show up, bring it for us. People of God, as you show up, dude, bring it for them as seriously as I hope they're bringing it for you. Bring it for the Lord. All right. Bring it. So love you guys. We'll see you next week.
God bless you.
